Seneca and Epictetus on wind

A very serious conversation with ChatGPT about goals and opportunities

Jannik: Consider the following two quotes. The first one is from Seneca and the second one is from Epictetus:

"Each time you want to know what to pursue or what to avoid, look to your highest good, the aim of your life as a whole. Everything we do ought to be in accordance with that aim. Only one who has the entirety of his life in view is in a position to arrange life’s particulars. Even with paints all at the ready, no one can render a likeness until he has decided what he wants to paint. That’s our mistake: everyone deliberates over the parts of life; no one over life as a whole. If you want to shoot an arrow, you must know what you are trying to hit: only then can you direct the point and steady the shaft. Our counsels are all astray in that they have no mark to aim at. If one doesn’t know what harbor to make for, there can be no favoring wind."

- Seneca, Letters 71.2-3

"if the weather prevents us from sailing, we sit there in a state of anxiety, constantly peering around. 'What wind is this?' The North Wind. And what does it matter to us and to him? When will the West Wind blow?' When it so chooses, my good friend, or rather, when Aeolus chooses; for God hasn't appointed you to be controller of the winds, he has appointed Aeolus. What are we to do, then? To make the best of what lies within our power, and deal with everything else as it comes."

- Epictetus, Discourses 1.1.16-17

Which similarities and which differences do you see between the two philosophers use of the wind metaphor here?

ChatGPT 4.0: Both Seneca and Epictetus, as Stoic philosophers, emphasize the significance of focusing on what is within one's control. They use the metaphor of the wind to illustrate the concept of aiming for what can be controlled and accepting what cannot.

Similarities:

1. The concept of direction: Both philosophers use the metaphor of the wind in relation to setting a course or direction. Seneca mentions "what harbor to make for," and that there cannot be a "favoring wind" without knowing the destination. Epictetus uses the wind as a factor that affects the sailing course but ultimately is not within our control.

2. Control and acceptance: Both philosophers use their metaphors to illustrate the need to focus on what's within our power. Seneca suggests that having a clear life goal allows one to navigate the particulars of life effectively. Epictetus, similarly, suggests focusing on what is in our control ("make the best of what lies within our power") and accepting what isn't (the direction of the wind).

Differences:

1. Object of control: In Seneca's metaphor, the wind is something to utilize to one's advantage, implying that it can be leveraged if one has a clear aim. It serves as a tool to help reach the goal. On the other hand, Epictetus portrays the wind as something completely out of human control, something that needs to be accepted as it is, and our actions should be adapted accordingly.

2. Approach to life's goal: Seneca proposes that we should decide our life's goal first, and then the smaller decisions (or winds) will help move us towards it. In contrast, Epictetus suggests that we should focus on what we can control in the moment and adapt to external circumstances as they arise, regardless of a singular life's goal.

3. Emotional response: While both philosophers advocate for acceptance, Epictetus explicitly talks about the emotional state ("a state of anxiety") that arises from focusing on uncontrollable factors. Seneca, on the other hand, doesn't delve into emotional reactions but rather focuses on the strategic aspect of setting life's goals.

Jannik: That's a great summary. In my opinion, though, the goal that Seneca is talking about can only be wisdom - the ability to deal optimally with any situation. If I'm right there seems to one difference less. But then I wonder if Seneca's idea of waiting for the right wind makes perfect sense. Wouldn't we rather want to be able to use every wind to our benefit than to wait for the right wind?

ChatGPT: Your interpretation offers an insightful perspective. Indeed, the highest good or goal that Seneca speaks of can indeed be understood as "wisdom" or "virtue" - a common theme in Stoic philosophy. This highest good would allow a person to respond optimally to every situation, using wisdom to handle all of life's circumstances.

When Seneca speaks about waiting for the "favoring wind", it could be interpreted less as waiting passively for conditions to be right, but more about aligning our actions, decisions, and efforts with our broader goals or with our wisdom. If wisdom is our harbor, the winds that push us towards it could be understood as the situations and experiences that encourage growth and learning.

However, one might argue, true wisdom (as Seneca might agree) would indeed be able to use "every wind" to our benefit. This interpretation might be closer to Epictetus' perspective who emphasized adapting our actions based on what is in our control in any given situation - the equivalent of using whichever wind is blowing to keep the ship sailing.

In essence, the main difference might lie in the emphasis: Seneca encourages understanding our highest good first (wisdom, in this interpretation) and aligning our life with that, whereas Epictetus focuses more on dealing with situations as they arise and utilizing wisdom in the moment. But, as you've pointed out, the underlying principle of using wisdom as a guiding principle in life is indeed a shared element in both perspectives.

Jannik: But if our goal is to deal wisely with any wind, every wind will be an opportunity for growth and learning. Don't you agree?

ChatGPT: Absolutely, I agree with your interpretation. If our primary aim, as suggested in Stoicism, is to cultivate wisdom and virtue, then every "wind" or situation indeed provides an opportunity for growth and learning. Each situation, regardless of its nature, can be used to exercise our wisdom, to grow in understanding, and to strengthen our virtues.

Every "wind," whether it's favorable or unfavorable, easy or challenging, is a chance to put our wisdom into practice. In this sense, there are no truly adverse winds, only different opportunities to exercise and deepen our wisdom. This perspective aligns with the Stoic emphasis on accepting what is beyond our control while focusing on improving our own responses and virtues, which are within our control.

This understanding ties together both Seneca's and Epictetus's perspectives nicely, where the ultimate goal (or harbor) is wisdom, and the journey involves navigating the various winds that life presents us with. So, while there might be slight differences in emphasis or framing, both philosophers converge on the principle of using every life situation as an opportunity for growth in wisdom and virtue.

Jannik: Yes, I think that is correct. I think that what might confuse is that Seneca seems to imply that there can be such a thing as a wrong wind for a wise person or a person striving towards wisdom - but I guess what he actually means is that to a fool no wind is the right wind and to wise person every wind is the right wind. Don't you think?

ChatGPT: Yes, I agree with your interpretation. In a sense, Seneca is arguing that for a person who has not determined a clear direction or purpose in life (a "fool" in this context), no wind will seem favorable, as they have no goal towards which to strive. They will be aimlessly adrift, unable to utilize the winds effectively because they lack a clear destination.

On the other hand, for a wise person who knows their goal (which, as we have agreed, is wisdom), every wind can be seen as favorable, as it presents an opportunity for growth and learning. It isn't the nature of the wind that matters, but the sailor's ability to use it to their advantage. This idea aligns well with the Stoic principle of focusing on what is within our control (our responses, actions, and attitudes) rather than what is not (the nature and direction of the winds of life).

Therefore, Seneca's use of the wind metaphor might be less about waiting for the "right" wind and more about being equipped with the wisdom to use any wind beneficially. In other words, to the wise person, every wind is the "right" wind.

Gerard van Honthorst: An old woman (1623). SMK, Copenhagen, Denmark